Alaska to Chicago?

Does anyone know if and when Alaska will start flying SEA-ORD or SEA-MDW?

Not anytime in the forseeable future. AS maintains close ties with AA and AA would view this as a war cry. They are allowed to begin service on "Alaska's routes" (ORD-ANC) but AS better not touch "their" routes lest they bear the wrath of AA. Go figure??? I say AS should just junk their relationship with AA, tighten their ties with NW and CO and start flights to ORD, DFW, MIA, JFK and wherever else they see that there is money to be made. We've already proven that we can take them on in most markets (SJC-PDX/SEA, SEA-ANC, etc.) and survive - I don't see what they provide to Alaska other than a frequent flyer arrangement.

I heard rumors that it might happen sooner, but oh well.
Go M's !!!!

AA would have a cow if AS started flying to ORD I'm pretty sure. Who knows, but I can imagine that they would probably jump right down AS' throat. Which, is exactly why AS won't go into MIA. And you can bet that as soon as AS went into MIA and started filling those planes up - AA would start their own SEA-MIA nonstops.

As for the airport gates at LAX - they are all owned by the airport and AA and AS both lease the gates from the airport. I believe that AS is currently sharing a gate or two with AA and the word at AS is that AA will be relinquishing most of their former TW/QQ gates to AS soon enough. As for the boardroom at LAX - we are going to be staffing it with AS employees soon as we will be buying 1/2 of the room and sharing it with AA - so it will be as much theirs as ours soon enough as well.

People seem to like AA and what they bring to the table but it wasn't so long ago that they weren't even in the picture. None the less, I imagine that AS isn't considering getting rid of them anytime soon. I do believe that AA stands in AS' way in terms of making more money - but again, that's just my opinion.

From a frequent flyer standpoint, that's a huge bonus. However, we do offer partnerships with another airline that has extensive Caribbean, South American and Latin American service.... Continental. If we could somehow score more award seats on their flights then what, really, does AA bring to the table? From a business stand point, I'm sure they bring some additional passenger traffic to AS - but, enough to really make a huge difference?

AA seems to stand in the way of expansion. AS could expand into just about any market from the pacific NW and do well. AS has VERY loyal customers in Seattle, Portland, Anchorage and even the L.A. basin and the bay area. Basically, all up and down the West Coast. Because AA currently flies some highly coveted routes, we are not able to fly those routes. Even though there is a large demand for AS to fly on some of them. You don't see that arrangement with the CO/NW arrangement. They both fly routes that overlap and feed each others flights on those routes. They work together instead of trying to continue to compete fiercely against each other.

I don't know all the ins and outs behind these relationships and I'm sure there is more than I know - I didn't even know that you could get award seats on AA easily - but it seems that this relationship is going to be a thorn in AS' side one day. That's just my prediction.

I think the biggest problem with adding flights to the East Coast from Portland is that most of the traffic through the airport is O & D (origin and destination). The only logical connection for an IAD-PDX passenger would be a flight to Hawaii, or perhaps to someplace else in Oregon. However, at SEA, the connection opportunities are more numerous, including flights to British Columbia, Asia, and of course Alaska.

Without opportunities for connecting flights, I'm not sure if there is enough demand for trans-con non-stops.

That's why it's a partnership. There's a little give and take in every airline partnership. I for one like having AA as a partner airline. The MRTC is a big bonus over CO. The more choices for AS frequent flyer's the better.

Originally posted by AS Flyer:
Not anytime in the forseeable future. AS maintains close ties with AA and AA would view this as a war cry. They are allowed to begin service on "Alaska's routes" (ORD-ANC) but AS better not touch "their" routes lest they bear the wrath of AA. Go figure??? I say AS should just junk their relationship with AA, tighten their ties with NW and CO and start flights to ORD, DFW, MIA, JFK and wherever else they see that there is money to be made. We've already proven that we can take them on in most markets (SJC-PDX/SEA, SEA-ANC, etc.) and survive - I don't see what they provide to Alaska other than a frequent flyer arrangement.

I have to disagree with you AS Flyer....

That "frequent flyer arrangement" is a HUGE benefit to our FF members. AA has some of the best award seat availability out there. Especially into the Caribbean, Mexico, Central/South America and lately even Hawaii and Europe.

I don't think CO's Caribbean and South American service is anything close to AA's.

AA is needed as a major partner in Alaska's mileage plan. East coast codeshares, LAX Boardroom sharing, award availability, So. Cal Eagle codeshares, etc. But I hate the wAAy they have "their" routes. SEA-BOS was apparently one of "their" routes even though AA was not serving it when AS announced service. AA is one reason I think AS will go into EWR and not JFK when it starts flying to NYC. I bet AA would be all pissy if AS announced MIA service even though AA cancelled its own service and pull the same crap they pulled over BOS. IIRC AS leases some LAX gates from AA; can any of our great employees on the board confirm this? AS needs more gates down there and doesn't need AA to get cranky.

I hate their AAnticompetitive AAttitude but I would much rather have them as a close partner than CO (though I wish the CO partnership was closer than it is!)

But who knows, maybe AA wouldn't get mad over SEA-ORD since its not a monopoly route for them like SEA-BOS was.

If you want to see what a great airline CO is and how they continually "enhance" their FF'ers, head over to the CO board.

While I personally have a lot of miles on NW, and love their frequent mileage bonuses, there's a lot of discussion on that board about continual or worsening lack of award availability. AA is generally acknowledged to be the best in that department.

So, do not dismiss the benefits of AA to AS FF'ers so easily. Also, MRTC is excellent and makes them the carrier of choice.

Originally posted by AS Flyer:
AA would have a cow if AS started flying to ORD I'm pretty sure. Who knows, but I can imagine that they would probably jump right down AS' throat. Which, is exactly why AS won't go into MIA. And you can bet that as soon as AS went into MIA and started filling those planes up - AA would start their own SEA-MIA nonstops.
...People seem to like AA and what they bring to the table but it wasn't so long ago that they weren't even in the picture. None the less, I imagine that AS isn't considering getting rid of them anytime soon. I do believe that AA stands in AS' way in terms of making more money - but again, that's just my opinion.

I agree, I wish the relationship could be more symbiotic. The ability to earn miles on AA is a big perk, but it almost seems like Alaska could be doing more without having to worry about how American would respond and how their partnership would be changed.

Alaska and American are both running ANC-ORD flights during the summer, AS sells space on both flights. Now they're both serving SEA-BOS.

Wouldn't it be great if Alaska could serve MIA and then codeshare with AA's flights out of MIA? It seems like AA would be pleased to have the revenue for flights out of MIA, but I also believe American's response would be to reinstate their SEA-MIA service rather than to allow Alaska to grow their route system into one of their hubs.

This reminds me of Legend Airlines and their all first class flights from Dallas' Love Field.

American started offering all first-class fights from Love, waited until Legend went out of business and then pulled out of the airport.

It was nice while it lasted!

-Robert

A big plus for me is AS's partnerships with soooo many airlines. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/biggrin.gif

Essentially, they are oneworld, plus KLM, CO, and NW, minus Cathay, Finnair, Iberia, and Aerlingus. That sounds like a good trade for a North American.

I agree that CO is next to worthless for redeeming miles and weak to South America. How do I get to Santiago w/o AA and LanChile? http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/frown.gif But its worth AS keeping CO onboard for earning miles. Does AS want to fly to EWR and IAH on its own to satisfy (keep?) its own FF'ers?

NW makes up for AA's weakness in Asia, and KLM-NW gives us several options for European travel. Wish there was PDX-AMS or PDX-LHR, but maybe that will happen when PDX grows up...

I do see 2 or 3 areas for AS to focus its expansion plans.

1. Continue to look at serving UA/DL/US cities (the main carries outside the AS dating game). SEA-SLC or SEA-ATL, or SEA-Toronto maybe?

2. Offer PDX and Calif. cities some of the east coast connections as SEA has been getting. PDX-IAD could use some competition!

3. Look into either an Asian service or an Asian partnership. How about PDX-TYO or PDX-SEL which Delta cut out recently? Maybe Korean Air or JAL as a partner?

But overall, the core strategy of AS seems solid. Don't lose the partnerships!

being a loyal AA flyer and a newer AS convert, i am of the opinion that this is a great partnership.

partially because as much as i love AA's MRTC product, i like AS's inflight service even better and i have short legs and am super-flexible anyhow. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

i like the AA-AS alliance. i have comfort that if i move to Seattle, i can at least get year-round nonstop service to Boston, and hopefully soon to NYC, between them. (AA's service is seasonal to NYC, see) i'd rather drink mercury than fly UA, and CO has "enhanced" my Infinite Super Elite Plat For Life membership out of usefulness.

AA's a great partner for AS. reward seat availability, complementary networks, etc. is it perfect? naah. but they're excellent partners for me.

Originally posted by South of the Border:
2. Offer PDX and Calif. cities some of the east coast connections as SEA has been getting. PDX-IAD could use some competition!

3. Look into either an Asian service or an Asian partnership. How about PDX-TYO or PDX-SEL which Delta cut out recently? Maybe Korean Air or JAL as a partner?

But overall, the core strategy of AS seems solid. Don't lose the partnerships!

AS currently offers a PDX-IAD through flight with a stop in SEA. Flt. 4 goes PDX-SEA-IAD. and flt. 15 goes BOS-SEA-PDX. So, it looks like AS is offering some east coast connections/through service from PDX.

As for the asian carrier connections, I think that their NW connection to NRT and KIX from SEA/LAX/SFO is pretty good. Once you get to NRT, you can pretty much go anywhere.

In answer to the question ie: EWR/IAH. I've heard that AS is considering service to both, in spite of CO's existing service.

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